The 700 Conversations: How Deep Listening Transforms District Leadership

Dr. Jim: [: 00:00:00

One element of that approach needs to include the members of the community who have no stake in the district. That's one piece in a broader entry plan that can set you up for sustained success. That's what we're gonna be tackling in today's conversation. Today we have Eric Byrne, who is the superintendent of Rye City School District, and he's been in that role since 2017. Prior to coming to Rye, he was an assistant superintendent for curriculum and instruction for six years in the Chappaqua Centrals.

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He's been an adjunct professor at Fordham University's Graduate School of Education for more than 20 years. In addition, he was the president of the Lower Hudson Council of School Superintendents from 2021 to 2023, and he's the recipient of the Lower Hudson Council of School Superintendents Distinguished Service Award in 2023.

Dr. Byrne has a Bachelor of Arts in Natural Science from Fordham and a Master's of Science in Teaching, and in EDD in Educational Leadership administration and policy, both from Fordham University's Graduate School of Education. So with all that, Eric, welcome to the show.

Dr. Eric Byrne: So much, Jim, it's great to be here and I appreciate this opportunity to be with you today.

nd it doesn't get any easier [: 00:02:00

So I think this is gonna be a valuable conversation for those folks who are gonna be listening that are maybe 10, 15 years behind you in terms of their career art. So I'm looking forward to getting into that discussion. But before we dive into that part of the conversation, it's gonna be important for you to get the listeners up to speed with some of the things that really helped shape your career and perspective and leadership philosophy.

So what were some of those foundational moments or critical moments in your career that help develop you into the person that you are today?

ally extraordinary visionary [: 00:03:00

Dr. Jim: I really appreciate you walking us through those different mentors that that impacted your career.

I think one of the. The things that I'm curious about is when you think about your role now, and here's where I'm coming from when I ask this question. Oftentimes when people cite mentorship, it can mean. Whole lot of different things to a whole lot of different people. And it shows up in all sorts of different ways a across organizations.

that an organization focuses [: 00:05:00

What are some of those intentional things that you've done that's taken the luck out of getting noticed?

Dr. Eric Byrne: That's a really great question. So I think the. Setting up regular times for conversations with my leaders and having weekly or monthly, depending on the time that they've been with us those regular meetings and regular times to talk. And get to know each other even better are critically important in that work.

So for my new principals, it's new leaders. It's a weekly meeting after a couple of years. We, they have an option to transition to every other week or every two weeks. That's something that we work through together. But having that dedicated time with all of my leaders on a regular basis is critically important in that noticing process.

ate because there's gonna be [: 00:06:00

Everything's on fire all the time, and those things have to get taken care of. So how can I fit in that weekly cadence of meetings with my entire team when we always have stuff that's going sideways within our environments?

that, but it's that regular [: 00:07:00

Dr. Jim: No, that's a really good point, and I appreciate that. I come from the private sector where, you know, those one-on-one meetings are done in offices or whatnot, but I like the fact that your one-on-one conversations are integrated into the environment. So you're having those conversations, but you're also observing what's going on to.

A broader view of what the landscape of the, what that principle is operating in. So I think that's a good clarification. I wanna switch gears a little bit and dig into some of the some of the specifics of the district that you're currently in. Now you've been here for a little while. I want you to take us back to when you first started in the district.

What did you observe about the district landscape and nuances that stood out to you?

cation to a lot of corporate [: 00:08:00

So that really incredible sense of community and longevity across generations is unique to Rye and one that I really appreciate.

ou're entering into a stable [: 00:09:00

So how did you approach knowing what you know about the district? What were the things that you did to get yourself in the mindset of getting to the next level versus keeping the lights on?

Dr. Eric Byrne: There was a whole bunch of things. So the early days, so in the interview process and right after I got hired for the position and before my first day. I watched I think there were three years of archive, board of education meetings on the school district website, and I watched every single one of them.

istrict and the needs of the [: 00:10:00

When I was at a regional professional learning event, I would just go right up to folks that had. Name text, it said Rise City School District and introduce myself and talk with them. And it was a really helpful part of the process. But I did make some very deliberate plans about how I was going to enter the school district from the early days of those first conversations with Board of Education trustees to when I was going to be arriving on July 1st of that summer.

in the district. The typical [: 00:11:00

I know there's a lot of factors that go into it. You can have the greatest plan in the world, but if it doesn't work, you can be out in two years. But that's clearly not the case for you. Walk us through what you did from an entry plan perspective that you believe set yourself up for success and getting this tenure that's atypical in this superintendency ranks.

udgets, things like that. To [: 00:12:00

So inviting every single staff member to sit with me for an entry interview. So one, I first, I developed a plan I put a draft together. [00:13:00] I shared it with the board of education and got their feedback. I shared it with the full administrative team, so all the principals, assistant principals, directors. I came and met with them before I even began the process of implementing the plan. shared it with them, presented it, and then we followed a protocol so that they could give me feedback on it. I made revisions based on the feedback from both the board and the administrative team, and then finalized it, presented it to the community, and started doing it and sitting for the interviews, and it really was. An incredible research project that helped me develop a really deep understanding of Rise City and of the Rise City School district that has informed basically every decision and action I've taken since I started that job back in 2017.

things that I'm wondering is [: 00:14:00

Dr. Eric Byrne: I would say it was in design, probably 50 50 in implementation. It was probably 75 25 with 75 being the people because the connecting with the people and the talking with the people. Informed, understanding the operational and business side. So when I had conversations with all the folks in the business office and some of our vendors and people that we had been working with, it wasn't thinking about the consumer of our school system, the teachers in our school system, it was accomplishing two things in that I was developing relationships with folks on the operations and business side. And developing an understanding of what was happening on the operation and business side. [00:15:00] But overall, I think it was well over probably between six and 700 interviews that I conducted as part of this entry plan, external it was a combination of both. I, so I think terms of relationship wise, it was heavy on the relationship development.

Dr. Jim: So when you look at that interview process, what were, did you use a standardized set of questions or was it more open-ended in your approach? And how did that inform some of the business assumptions that you had made in your entry plan? I.

Dr. Eric Byrne: So I had developed questions that I shared. For everyone. It was the same set of questions for everyone. And the last question was always, is there anything else that I've forgotten to ask you? So I asked about people's backgrounds. I asked about their feelings about the school district and things that made them proud about the school district or things that they saw as needs and weaknesses of the school district.

to every single person I met [: 00:16:00

Dr. Jim: it's interesting that you developed this robust plan that was heavy on the people side. I. There are probably some people that are sitting in the, in, in the audience thinking I think if I'm gonna develop an entry plan, I'm probably gonna index even more to the people side and let the technical operations side take a secondary precedence.

What's the error in that thinking?

r. Eric Byrne: I think that, [: 00:17:00

Dr. Jim: [00:18:00] Good stuff. So when you look at everything that you did in the lead up to coming into the district there was a lot of information gathering that came out of it. So when you look at the business side and you look at the people side of the equation, what were some of the common themes that came out of those conversations that informed your priorities going forward?

Dr. Eric Byrne: From the business and operations side, it was under investment in the system, in the facilities, in the, on the operational side of things. And I think there was a great fear that the community, which is fiscally conservative and was even more fiscally conservative then was not interested in supporting. Financial investment in the school district. So that was a big learning for me that research, those conversations that, there, there was a sense that we did not need to put money into systems and facilities, pieces of the school district. So that was a huge learning piece for me.

Dr. Jim: So [: 00:19:00

Dr. Eric Byrne: So one I. I, I had longer conversations with folks trying to really understand that issue. So one of the common things that I heard was it was fine when I was in school it should be fine for the kids now. Or I heard we don't need, all those. things and the bells and whistles. We just need the basics to be successful. what I started to do in those conversations was weave in the importance of the facilities and how, sharing the research, which was some of my research that I had done in my career and my dissertation on the importance of the facility and [00:20:00] space. In kids success in schools today. So if we wanted to have kids be able to attend well in school, having fresh air ventilation and good lighting and acoustics, those are really important pieces today that may not have had. The relevance or importance when someone was in school during their time. It was certainly not something that was considered when I was in school, but educating folks and really sharing with them the research and the potential impact and how that could help us really important. So I think. Making that case and developing that relationship is in those conversations, establishing a relationship with each individual so that when I did come out and ask and say, we need your support in this, people were, they were looking at me as someone that they knew as opposed to this talking head who was the guy that's running the school district. it was a more [00:21:00] personal connection with individuals.

Dr. Jim: Now that's a really good point. And it's interesting because I think parents of all types go back in their minds to well, I had to do that when I was a kid. They didn't have this many snow days when I was a kid. We had no air conditioning in the summer when I was a kid, and our heat didn't work great when I was a kid.

And I like the fact that you're tying it into the research, but you're also asking in a subtle way. When you noticed those things when you were a kid, how much attention were you paying to what was happening in the front of the room versus what was happening be between your ears, because your point about you have to create the environment for learning is is really what I take away from it.

But if people are distracted by all sorts of external things because they're afraid the piece of the ceiling is gonna fall off on their head, that's gonna impact what they.

Dr. Eric Byrne: It.

strict and you have a stable [: 00:22:00

And if you're looking at. Headwinds from an investment perspective and another set of headwinds where there are people in the community that have no stake in the game. How did you overcome that second piece of that equation? What was the conversation that you had with those folks that don't have kids in the district?

izations. I became a regular [: 00:23:00

Dr. Jim: So when you map this out, it. I'm [00:24:00] getting a time crunch in what you're describing. So you have all of this people centered activity that you're doing within the district, so we can say that it's at the building level or at the district level. Then you have another element of the people side of the equation, which includes families and engaging with them and.

Gathering from them what the student experience has been. So those are two different stakeholders that you have to wrap your head around. Then you have this third element where there are. People in the community that are part of the district that have no skin in the game when it comes to the district.

But you have to be involved in the various organizations so that they can put the name to a face. And I'm thinking of myself as a first time superintendent and I'm looking at all of this. I didn't have to do this as an assistant sup. I'm just gonna focus in on the district level folks and the families because I don't have enough time to do all that other stuff.

u can hit all of these bases [: 00:25:00

Dr. Eric Byrne: One I gave up my personal life. And that's to be perfectly frank. I think one of the challenges that faces that is facing school district today is people coming into the superintendency. Before they're ready and not just ready in terms of what their knowledge and skill is, but their life is ready.

ved I needed to be, the time [: 00:26:00

But it literally, the superintendency, when people say it's a. A 24 7, 365 job. It is. It is. if you're going to do this the right way and certainly the 24 hour piece is outside of your control because things come up and you, your phone rings in the middle of the night and you have to navigate that and deal with it.

but certainly my research on [: 00:27:00

Dr. Jim: I like your point about how you have to be prepared for it from a mental perspective and a lifestyle perspective and create space for the depth of the role.

The thing that I'm wondering is if I'm an assistant superintendent and I want to get to the next level, but I don't want to have that leap feel like I'm jumping into a bucket of ice water, what are the things that I can do as an assistant sup to better prepare for the demands of that next role? What would your advice be there?

runs a great superintendent [: 00:28:00

It is something that. That they like to participate so that they can understand. What it means to be interacting with all aspects and all stakeholders in the community around the annual budget vote. So they come and I listened to them and some of them have said, I'd like to play a greater role.

job, and then work with your [: 00:29:00

Dr. Jim: So I really like your point about having the conversation with the superintendent to define the areas that you can quote unquote play in. I would imagine part of that has to be strategic too, on your part as an assistant sup, where you have to be self-aware about the weaknesses that you have in your own game and focus on developing those, because if those aren't shored up.

The right way before you take that next leap. It's gonna blow up when the job gets busier. Am I thinking about this the right way?

ty to be at the table during [: 00:30:00

I had done that strategy work. I had understood how you prepared for the, to launch negotiations and so my assistant superintendents, I gave them the opportunity. To participate in negotiations from the planning through the sitting at the table in our last round of negotiations, and they've taken me up on that.

Dr. Jim: when I think about this conversation, here's the roadmap that I have so far. Building a strong entry plan should involve deep research across both the operational and people side of the equation. So that's one element of it. Then you should be doing a listening.

strict per se, but are gonna [: 00:31:00

So I look at those three, buckets as things that should be incorporated into an entry plan. The thing that we haven't talked about is, okay, when you look at coordinating all those pieces and actually doing the work, what's the timeline of getting all this stuff done?

Dr. Eric Byrne: That's a really a good noticing, Jim because I developed the entry plan coming into rye. I anticipated that, so I was appointed to the job in at the end of February. I anticipated that I would start having conversations late March, early April with folks before I officially began. I did interviews with the Board of Education trustees and the school administrators.

would be done with the entry [: 00:32:00

But [00:33:00] certainly I think anticipating a six month entry process is realistic for just about every school district.

Dr. Jim: I want you to zoom out a little bit. This entire conversation has been about setting yourself up for success, and you're an outlier when it comes to the shelf life of a typical superintendent having been in your role for eight years.

So when you think about setting yourself up for success. By way of a strong entry plan, if you're advising somebody else on what a strong entry plan looks like, what are the com key components that they need to pay attention to so that they can try to replicate what your experience has been within their districts?

rintendency. I think there's [: 00:34:00

Dr. Jim: Great stuff. If if people wanna continue the conversation what's the best way for them to get in touch with you?

. There are a couple of rise [: 00:36:00

I am on LinkedIn, and happy to continue conversations in that way.

Dr. Jim: Awesome stuff. So I appreciate you hanging out with us, Eric, and sharing your insights and best practices when it comes to entry plans and also setting yourself up for success. And I think there's a lot in this discussion that's worth digging into, but there's one particular aspect that I think it's really important to.

Highlight and we often fall into the trap that. Whenever we take on a new role, there's a defined beginning, middle, and end of that role. And I think one of the things that I take away from what you described is that there's almost you're almost better served at periodically resetting your mindset as if you new person in the district and opening the door for more feedback that'll inform how you move forward.

you look at. Building strong [: 00:37:00

Sets you up for success and keeps things fresh, and always helps you get to that next level. So that's the broader lesson that I take away from that. Now, on a granular level. I think one of the big things that people that step into a superintendency role need to be aware of is that it's critical for you to shore up as many of your gaps before you get into the role, so that way it doesn't blow up on you when you're actually in the seat.

broader community as a third [: 00:38:00

Those I feel are really important things to call out in this conversation. I appreciate you sharing that with us. For those of you who've been listening to the conversation, we appreciate you hanging out. Make sure you leave us a review if you like the discussion. If you haven't already done so, make sure you join our K through 12 leadership community.

And then tune in next time where we'll have another great leader hanging out with us and sharing with us the game changing insights that help them build a high performance team.